May I add my voice to those many who will be congratulating the Bishop, and thanking God, for his excellent article. There is however an essential ingredient which may have been taken for granted, but which surely needs special mention. That is the fact that a society can only be transformed by citizens who have themselves been transformed. Jesus spells out that without Him and His promised Holy Spirit we simply do not have the power to make it work. With Him, however, all things become possible. Dear Bishop, thank you, and keep speaking out!

I think that this problem existed long ago. But why so late in the UK have begun to analyze it? ..

This is just plain absurd. It isn't the loss of Christianity that is to blame but the overindulgence of religious superstition in the name of multiculturalism and cultural relativism. I hardly think the answer to one brand of evidenceless obscurantism is another, but rather a heary deense of secular values and Enlightenment thinking ala Ayaan Hirsi Ali. We should tolerate both Islam and Christianity until the point that they claim special rights for beliefs for which they can produce no evidence and make moral claims based on the flimsy formulation "God said so."

Congratulations on this piece. I and many like me are devastated and disappointed that the Christian faith, and its apparent leaders lack the moral fortitude to defend their corner. My Christianity is unashamedly of the muscular variety, I am intensely proud of the Judeo-Christian tradition, and am very much conscious that western civilisation would not exist without it. That is, without this tradition, there would be no "human rights" "womens rights", electricity, industrial revolution, etc etc.

As an Australian Citizen I am pleased to see Standpoint give such prominace to an article by a Bishop.I feel it is a very good piece , but I am uncomforable with it's general message. Would we be truly in a better place with leaders who were truly confessinfg christians. George Bush certainly gave the impression that he was a christian leader, it has been reported thathis administration made over 900 lies in the lead up to the Iraq war. His former press sectary alleges that his main purpose in going to war was a determination for re election. Jesus called us to laven in the lump , not to be agents of contol and donination.

To Peter Brawley: You can as well argue the opposite. The greatest atrocities of the past century have been committed by nations which overtly discarded religion and sought to eliminate its influence. I would also argue that it is a mistake to lump all religions together when you make such sweeping broadsides as "Overall, the more religious a society is, the more crime, poverty, tyranny etc it suffers." With Bishop Nazir-Ali, I argue for the distinctiveness of Christianity as a civilizing influence in human culture. I would agree with you that the Islamic doctrine of jihad, the Hindu caste system, and the fatalism of Buddhist thought are negative influences to be resisted. I would put these in stark contrast to "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and and with all your strength and with all your mind, and love your neighbor as yourself."

Now we have gotten quite specific, Peter. I wonder if you could sketch for me the causal link between Christianity and criminality in the Western democracies.

What a shame fundamentalists of all stipes, be they theists or non-theists, Marxists or Enlightenment Faithful, or anything else, all want to place the blame for the planet's problems at the door of the blind unquestioning beliefs of the adherents of other "answers". None is really interested in examining the role of human nature too carefully, because one thing all faiths have in common is that what they find doesn't always support the kind of "solution" that's too dear to their hearts to risk tight analysis which will endanger their (often noble) plans. Even universities began shying away from analysing popular accepted secular articles of faith in the sixties, so why should religions be held to a higher standard? If we're not careful, next thing you know we'll be questioning astrology, ouija boards, and other growth industries of the sixties. p.s. Your spam test is so difficult to interpret that I began to wonder if I really am human.

To Peter Brawley: I like to know why you see religion more as a threat than a chance. Because unconsciously you very well know that the promises of the Entlightement - such as the reign of Universal Reason/Humanism sometime in the future - will or can never be achieved? The Enlightement has produced many great things, but also evils such as communism, nationalism, environmental destruction, etc etc. These evils are proof of the fallen nature of man. Are you rejecting religious truths because you cannot accept than man is by his nature not as reasonable as you need him to be? The rule of Universal Reason, of Humanism only makes sense if man is inherently reasonable - but one can empirically observe in reality that he is not and will never be. I feel this is somewhat at the heart of those who get nervous in the face of religious certainties. The ideals (or dogmas) of the Enlightement are exactly this: mere fantastic ideals, not realities reflecting the nature of man. The not so honorable history of the 20th century shows us to be wary of such a dogmatic understanding of Reason. But religion has never made a case against reason itself. Reason (not as a dogma like in the Enlightement) is deeply imbedded in Christianity. It is time for a truce between reason and faith! It is time to rediscover the roots of reason in our religious tradition without neglecting the good fruits of the Enlightement.

We live in a shrunken world and millions of people are on the move; one of our biggest challenges is how we learn to live in proximity to difference – different skin colours, different beliefs and different way of life. According to a study by COMPAS, Muslims born and educated were given the impression of outsiders. The perception among Muslims is that they are unwelcome in Britain is undermining efforts to help them integrate into wider society. Most of them say that they have experienced race discrimination and religious prejudice. Muslims and Islam is promoted a fundamentalist and separatist by the western elite, which have negative impact on community and social cohesion. The number of racist incidents occurring in London Borough of Redbridge’s schools have reached their highest levels since record begin. A City or a locality, where Muslims are in majority is a ghetto. There is a tendency for people of similar backgrounds to live together in neighourhoods. The term”ghettoisation” is inappropriate. The original ghettos in Europe during the middle ages were set up by law to confine the Jewish population to one area of a city. According to a research by an Australian academic that Muslim communities in Britain are being increasingly ghettoized in a trend that set back hopes of assimilation by years. Britain has now eight cities in the top 100 most ghettoized cities. The people from the Pakistani community in Bradford and Oldham and Leicester had trebled during the decade. A report by an academic Dr Alan Carling, that Bradford risks becoming a front line in the global clash between the West and Islam. But Islam and Muslims do not clash with the concepts of pluralism, secularism and globalisation. The native flight from Bradford’s inner-city wards showed clear evidence of an increase in segregation in the city since 1991. Native parents are avoiding sending their children in state schools where Muslims and other minorities are in majority. The dominance of Pakistani Muslims in the city has meant that Bradford has become bi-cultural. Immigrants are the creators of Britain new wealth, otherwise, inner cities deprived areas could not get new lease of life. The native Brits regard such areas as ghettoes. Integration is not religious and cultural, it is economic and Muslims are well integrated into British society and at the same time they are proud of their Islamic, linguistic and cultural identities, inspite of discrimination they have been facing in all walks of life. According to UN, 80% of British Muslims feel discriminated. They are less burden on social services. Immigrants made up 8.7% of the population, but accounted for10.2% of all collected income tax It is often quoted by the Western media that Muslim schools ghettoizse the children, and even lead to their radicalisation if they are not integrated. There is no evidence that faith schools lead to a “ghettoized education system. In British schools, pupils are encouraged to focus too much on their similarities rather than their differences. The integrationist approach merely results in Muslims feeling that their faith, language and culture is not respected. Iftikhar Ahmad www.londonschoolofislamics.org.uk

Andrew, you’ve no info about what I “unconsciously” know, or what I might “need” humankind to be. As far as I know, I don't need humankind to be anything. By definition “religious certainty” (like some other certainties) is delusional. Religion opposes reason ever time it trains a person to believe religious fairy tales over rational analysis of evidence.

To Bill Hensley: You have got to be kidding. The Bible teaches none of those values - one need not be a Christian to believe in any of these values you specify. Like all moderate enlightened Christians,, you have smuggled enlightenment values into the text, choosing to ignore things that don't support them. All those uncomfortable parts about child marriage, god-sanctioned genocide, etc. are chlaked up to "historical contingency" while the pleasant teachings of Jesus (of which Paul and others seemed either ignorant or more or less unconcerned with) are held up as fine moral teachings despite that fact that not a single sentmiment therein can't also be found in an earlier pagan work. And it wasn't their atheism that led to the depradations of communism and other totalatarisms, it was their commitment to worldviews, ideologies, and truth claims that were eerily similar in form to those of religion.

The objectivist moral claims of Judeo-Christian values have been replaced by Relativist 'values'. Relativism cannot stand up to a self-confident objectivist Islamism especially when the latter is backed by the treat of violence (eg Muhammad cartoons). Many Relativists undermine Judeo-Christian objective values, and give Islamism a free pass.

Brian, of course you will find some elements of truth in most religions. Almost no one gets everything wrong! But each of the values mentioned by Bishop Nazir-Ali does in fact find full expression in the Christian scriptures. Human dignity: "Show proper respect to everyone: Love the brotherhood of believers, fear God, honor the king." (I Peter 2:17) Equality: "There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus." (Galatians 3:28) Liberty: "You, my brothers, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the sinful nature; rather, serve one another in love." (Galations 5:13) Safety: "The commandments, 'Do not commit adultery,' 'Do not murder,' 'Do not steal,' 'Do not covet,' and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law." (Romans 13:9-10) Hospitality: "Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some people have entertained angels without knowing it." (Hebrews 13:2) Just to illustrate the unity of thought in the New Testament I pulled all of the above from the Epistles rather than the Gospels. Certainly each of these values was also taught by Jesus himself. Critics of Christianity like to treat the Bible piecemeal. They try to set Paul against Jesus, and the New Testament against the Old. But if you want to understand the core teachings of Christianity, I encourage you to focus on the whole New Testament, taken together, as being the final and fullest revelation of God's message to us. The Old Testament does not contradict the New, but must be understood in light of it. A complete picture of God must include both his judgement of sin and his sacrificial love. If you focus on one to the exclusion of the other you get a distorted picture. These values did not suddenly appear in Europe during the Enlightenment. It is better to say that the Enlightenment thinkers tried to liberate these ideas from their Christian substrate. In so doing, they unintentionally made them easier to discard in later centuries when such concepts became inconvenient to those who desired to wield absolute power with no moral constraints on their actions. When one understands that these values are rooted in the commandments of Almighty God it is evident that the cannot be ignored without disastrous consequences.

Too any people think that civility, honesty, loyalty to parents etc are christian values. This would only be the case if they, or their invocation, were unique to the gospel of christ. But they aren't. Confucius advocated these self same things. Aztecs brought up their children to be this also, even when they slaughtered prisoners of war for their gods. Christianity is something else, a love i have never seen in any church. Thus the church and public religion of Europe for the last 1700 years was never christianity. As for democracy stemming from christianity, the limitation of royal power was a germanic idea in which the king was the first of equals among his war band. There is in fact no trace of democracy in the Bible I am a convinced christian, but let us not obscure the issue by bad history or sentimental adherance to a cultural tradition

Yes bishop, a justified concern does exist over the absence of moral development in a growing proportion of children in western society. There is a justified concern also being expressed in many western countries over the inadequate deterrents reflected in the sentences or punishments now being given to the worst kind of criminals, i.e. those who are guilty of having complete contempt for their victims. Yes, these concerns are nothing new, since the 1960s many including myself have watched this situation grow steadily worse as decreasing deterrents and a forsaking of established values have worked as an incentive for all kinds of evil. But probably the greatest concern for me right now is that we live in a democracy where the majority of voters have freely and repeatedly elected politicians who, in these last few decades, have continued passing legislation that allows and encourages evil to increase. Despite all of the promises from politicians, nothing effective comes from them, nothing is being achieved by them that would curb and overcome this worsening evil in our society. Under this growing and yet deceptive evil many of the electorate have grown ignorant, having now only contempt for the truth; and for as long as enough of these blind and gullible voters continue to hold sway at elections, so also will evil naturally continue to increase in strength, but not just in the West: Working through unseen enemies of the West, a most dangerous evil with all it's twisted reasoning and paranoia is growing and reaching out for the knowledge and power to destroy cities. Leaders of the revival of radical Islam who are now affecting millions with their extreme hatred for the growing depravity working through offensive western culture, which threatens to dominate or destroy their faith, have already begun their quest for weapons of mass destruction. A growing number of Muslims then, as they become radicalized, are able to believe more easily they are the ones fighting the just war and that it is good for them to offer their lives to kill or maim whoever seriously threatens their religion and authority... and let no one underestimate how Islam controls those who take the word and the way of this religion seriously...

There is a lot of insecurity and confussion in Britain otday. This has had a terrible effect on its youth. Studies have confirmed this. A young person having the same faith as the Queen is punished because she does not bless gay marriage. Thwo others were threatened with arrest by a British police officer - a Muslim, I believe - because they were talking about their faith to some muslims. Apparently, they have no right to be in that part of London! It's a Muslim area!!!

Atheistic leaders in the USSR and China slaughtered millions of their own citizens. Millions more were tortured and those that are alive will not agree with some of the outlandish statements made by religion-knockers here.

The Churches only have themselves to blame, they have conspired with socialism since 1945 and abdicated their responsibility to the people to the 'Welfare State'

This should not be about whose religion is "right" or "wrong". This should be about the ability of out nation's religions - and athiests - to co-exist without conflict or without the need to overshadow one-another. I am only 19 and yet I am greatly saddened by what I see has become of this once great country. Britain is weak and lacking in identity. This is nothing to do with how many Muslims we have, how many Christians we have or how many Hindus we have. It is to do with how many horrible, nasty excuses for human beings we have roaming our streets and running our country, and the rifts that they driving open between our many wonderful communities. The religious and non-religous alike should be uniting against these hatemongers, not each other.

When I was young I attended Church every Sunday with my family and was ridiculed for doing so by the neighbourhood children. As I grew up and learnt more about religion and the world in general: new discoveries, technologies and ideologies I too turned away from God. How in an age of reason could a person believe in and worship children's stories and fairy tales? And then I continued to grow up and discovered that although one didn't necessarily have to believe in the supernatural aspects of God one could believe in his teachings. Being a good and moral person how could one scorn the teachings of the bible? I was happy to discover that a man born some two hundred years ago thought along the same lines that I was thinking, I am of course referring to Thomas Jefferson, the 3rd President of America, who took a pair of scissors to the Bible and cut out the supernatural aspects and repackaged it as "The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth". However after looking at the long-term impacts that removing the Church and God from studies, as he perpetrated, and day to day life I realised that you can't have one without the other. Some think that I am quite childlike in my belief that man can and will be better. At one time politicians were of quite good moral stock, yes you could always find a bad apple in the barrel but generally speaking recent history has shown that those who democratically governed us did so with truth and honesty. I do not believe that it is childish or naive to think that that time will come again, and is, in fact, closer than we realise. Politicians today have a bad rap and in most cases quite deservedly, but the new generation of politicians will learn from their predecessors they will see that they cannot base their careers and campaigns on lies and deceit because it is getting harder and harder to fool the public, and so the new stock of politicians wont be the same mealy mouthed rats that we have grown so accustomed too. They will be of the most impeccable scruples, morals and decentness. To believe in God is not to believe in "sky Gods" to believe in the teachings of God is not to believe in "nonsense" it is to believe in the better nature of man and to believe that man can and will be better. God doesn't insist that you genuflect to him, or that you partake in costly rituals. He only asks that you love him and that you love your neighbour. God will forgive even the most destitute sinner if that sinner truly repents. God is merciful but only if the mercy is deserved, many people have the mistaken belief that if you say sorry for your sins that it gives you leave to sin again: because you can always say sorry again and God loves you and will forgive you. God does love you and he will always forgive you, but remember whatever God does to you he does because he loves you. If you are of the stock that sins, makes a false apology and then sins again, he will find a way of making you truly repent before opening the doors of Heaven to you.

hola I can't agree with what you said really.... please ellaberate a bit more for me ;D thank you